Request - Enable Remote Display Server option in VMs

[Jacob Klein]

Christian / RNA World:

Could you please enable the Remote Display Server option in the VMs?

T4T uses this, and Rom said it's easy to turn on (possibly a 1-line change in some xml configuration definition file). It's really neat, because when a VM task uses it, the client includes a "Show VM Console" button underneath the "Show graphics button", and clicking it will use Windows Remote Desktop to remote into the VM to take a peek at it. That way, users like me could see what the forecast estimate is (even if it is unreliable). Note: the option can be found in the VirtualBox Manager UI, in VM -> Settings -> Display -> Remote Display -> Enable Server (and specify a server port); then you can connect manually using RDP to localhost:portnum

So, would you please consider enabling that feature, to make your VMs even more awesome? If not, then why not?

Thanks,
Jacob

[Dunuin]

As far as I know looking into the VM is causing errors and the WUs will fail.

[Jacob Klein]

Oh really? Can you please give me the steps to make one fail, like you suggest?
I tried on the T4T VM, and could not find a way. Please enlighten me.

[Dunuin]

Die 3 wurden mit Fehler bei Berechnung gemeldet, gab es wirklich einen Fehler bei der Berechnung, oder ist was anderes schief gelaufen? 6330532, 6330533, 6330534

Laut Aussage von Rom Walton warst du hier wohl etwas zu neugierig. Dieser session already locked Fehler kommt immer wenn ein anderer VBoxManage prozess die VM beobachtet. Das kann zur Zeit nicht geändert werden, dafür muss der vboxwrapper komplett neu gestrickt werden.

Translated...

This 3 WUs aborted with an error. Was it really an error or did something else go wrong? 6330532, 6330533, 6330534

According to Rom Walton you were too curious. This 'session already locked' error always appears if another VBoxManage process is watching the VM. This can't be fixed at the moment, for that the complete vboxwrapper needs to be reprogrammed.

[Jacob Klein]

Translated...

This 3 WUs aborted with an error. Was it really an error or did something else go wrong? 6330532, 6330533, 6330534

According to Rom Walton you were too curious. This 'session already locked' error always appears if another VBoxManage process is watching the VM. This can't be fixed at the moment, for that the complete vboxwrapper needs to be reprogrammed.

Thanks for your reply.

I am somewhat familiar with those "already locked" errors. I believe them to be completely unrelated to my request of enabling the Remote Desktop server functionality that provides the "Show VM Console" button. Do you think those errors are related in any way? If so, what proof do you have?

My request to enable the functionality still stands.

Thanks,
Jacob

[ChristianB]

There is nothing secret in the VM so we could enable this but on the other hand there is nothing fancy to see in there either.

I've never tried to RDP into the VM and always thought that T4T uses a webserver inside the VM to show something useful to the user. What would you see? Would you have read/write access to the guest filesystem or just see the console window?

In the first case you will see the forecast value in a file if there is only one DNA/RNA-pair in the task. If there are multiple than you only see the last pair because the sum of all forecasts is kept in-memory. If you only see the console than you have no access to the forecast or any other files.

If your interested in some internals I may, in a future version, output some kind of summary file to shared/ with some task information like forecast on this host, current DNA/RNA pair, memory usage.

[Jacob Klein]

Well, I expect to see the current VM. For the task I'm running, I went ahead and turned the Remote Desktop Server on before the first checkpoint was saved. So, I can actually RDP into it right now, and I see the forecast display (which you see a thumbnail of in the "Preview" section of the VirtualBox Manager screen). So, yes, when I click "Show VM Console", I expect to see the VM Console!

As far as showing "other useful stuff", that can be done via the "Show Graphics" button, where a website can be launched, like T4T does. I'm not saying you have to do it exactly like they do, but they did find a way to use another part of VM technology (I think using port forwarding, and probably another xml configuration line change), to output "more useful results" to a localhost:portnum website that gets opened in the browser, whenever the user clicks "Show Graphics".

I'd encourage you to get a T4T task, and see for yourself. And I'd like to see RNA World work the same way. Can you make it happen?

[ChristianB]

Well, I expect to see the current VM. For the task I'm running, I went ahead and turned the Remote Desktop Server on before the first checkpoint was saved. So, I can actually RDP into it right now, and I see the forecast display (which you see a thumbnail of in the "Preview" section of the VirtualBox Manager screen). So, yes, when I click "Show VM Console", I expect to see the VM Console!

That is a bug of the input files. Normally you won't see anything in the console window. Just some messages that the VM started and boinc_app is executed. After that all output is redirected into files. And it needs to be in files so the control script can parse it and calculate the forecast and we also need the output of cmsearch later so we redirect this in a file too.

As far as showing "other useful stuff", that can be done via the "Show Graphics" button, where a website can be launched, like T4T does. I'm not saying you have to do it exactly like they do, but they did find a way to use another part of VM technology (I think using port forwarding, and probably another xml configuration line change), to output "more useful results" to a localhost:portnum website that gets opened in the browser, whenever the user clicks "Show Graphics".

I'd encourage you to get a T4T task, and see for yourself. And I'd like to see RNA World work the same way. Can you make it happen?

I personally don't have any plans to support graphics from inside the VM or showing a website about "other usefull stuff" simply because I don't have the time and I don't see any useful stuff, cmsearch is not very talkative during computation. Graphics could be done outside the VM but wouldn't show the actual computation. So the only thing left is the DNA/RNA pair that is also encoded in the taskname. When someone else has a better idea or finds some useful stuff I'm happy to reevaluate this.

[Jacob Klein]

Well, I expect to see the current VM. For the task I'm running, I went ahead and turned the Remote Desktop Server on before the first checkpoint was saved. So, I can actually RDP into it right now, and I see the forecast display (which you see a thumbnail of in the "Preview" section of the VirtualBox Manager screen). So, yes, when I click "Show VM Console", I expect to see the VM Console!

That is a bug of the input files. Normally you won't see anything in the console window. Just some messages that the VM started and boinc_app is executed. After that all output is redirected into files. And it needs to be in files so the control script can parse it and calculate the forecast and we also need the output of cmsearch later so we redirect this in a file too.

Is there any way to have the text be both shown in the VM Console, as well as directed to file? Basically, even if you can't to that, and even if it's just "VM started and boinc_app executed", I still think you should turn the feature on. It's nice to be able to see the VM, and I would think it would encourage users to get excited about it. Unless you have a good reason not to do it, I'd still like to see it turned on, and it should be easy to do.

As far as showing "other useful stuff", that can be done via the "Show Graphics" button, where a website can be launched, like T4T does. I'm not saying you have to do it exactly like they do, but they did find a way to use another part of VM technology (I think using port forwarding, and probably another xml configuration line change), to output "more useful results" to a localhost:portnum website that gets opened in the browser, whenever the user clicks "Show Graphics".

I'd encourage you to get a T4T task, and see for yourself. And I'd like to see RNA World work the same way. Can you make it happen?

I personally don't have any plans to support graphics from inside the VM or showing a website about "other usefull stuff" simply because I don't have the time and I don't see any useful stuff, cmsearch is not very talkative during computation. Graphics could be done outside the VM but wouldn't show the actual computation. So the only thing left is the DNA/RNA pair that is also encoded in the taskname. When someone else has a better idea or finds some useful stuff I'm happy to reevaluate this.

I completely understand this. That's why I'm not terribly interested in anything being implemented on the "Show graphics" button. I just want the "Show VM Console" button to be available, to take a glimpse at, in case a user (like me) is curious/excited.

So, would you please consider making the "Show VM Console" button work for RNA World?

[ChristianB]

I keep it in my mind for the next version but I have to make sure that the user can't interfere with computation by accident.

[Jacob Klein]

Thank you!

Let us know if you find anything.
And, when I complete my current long VM, I'll try to do some testing too using a new VM to also see that the user can't interfere with computation.

[Crystal Pellet]

I keep it in my mind for the next version but I have to make sure that the user can't interfere with computation by accident.

Hi Christian,

The interested user can do it himself at the moment by enabling the Remote Display of the VM.
This can easily be done even on a running VM and the user don't have to do that before the first checkpoint. One can do that at every moment.

But when maybe in future the VM also would run, when BOINC is installed as a service, the access through VirtualBox Manager is impossible.
Then would "Show VM Console" from BOINC Manager the only way.

"Console" is not really the right word. It's just only a Display without interaction possibilities if not defined within the VM itself.

Interesting is the total prediction time. With my task almost 13 weeks, where the estimated runtime on the reference system was 7 weeks.
The lines after the prediction were probably from a write error within the VM already weeks ago.
The VM is running since 18th of September, almost 24/7.